Omfg

[OniCloud]

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/rpg/finalfantasyvii/media.html

I hope this goes into production because this'll be the first game I get for Ps3 for sure :D

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

...

They said in the article that you linked that it's not going to be made, it's just a tech demo.

[OniCloud]

Lol didn't read that, the other site I checked it out on said it's still under discussion. The site was www.gametrailers.com (http://www.gametrailers.com)

This is the only site I could link it on lol

[Zabur]

It's not a game. Also, **** squaresoft.

[Tanalius]

They should stop milking FF7

[Zabur]

they should stop making FF.

[OniCloud]

What I don't like is that instead of just making an actual re-make they always make spin-offs.


And to Zabur: I don't know what your beef is with squaresoft but seriously shut up.

I didn't call the thread "if you hate squaresoft raise your hand" So don't post if it has no relevance to the whole thread itself.

And why stop making FF's? Each individual FF game is its own, so the storylines in them will never get old and the gameplay is always new or modified. If you don't like the series then woopidee friggin doo don't post it here.

All I wanted was positive input on this for ****s sake

[Zabur]

Positive input about what? You post about a non-existant game?

Anyways, here is my beef with Square Enix:
They milk the name of their title and sell to millions of fan boys across the globe. They produce lesser quality goods every new FF that comes out. To me, they are on the same level with Microsoft.

Also, I can post where ever I damn well please.

[Yeef]

You can't post in space.

[Zabur]

You right. I have to kill you now.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

Yeah, they pretty much know that they can slap the Final Fantasy title on any peice of shit and sell millions of copies, I think it's taken away from their desire to make good games.

[Lexar]

Not to mention the people that like FF games so much... Oooh sephiroth ohhhh :(

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

Yeah, FF fanboys piss me off to no end.

[Izzy/K]

what games DO you like Bran?, cuz all I ever see comin out of you are bad comments about every single videogame discussions, Im not not tryin to diss you or anythin, just honestly asking...

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

I like pretty much any kind of game if they're good, I have a pretty massive game collection. Favorites would probably be stealth games and survival horror.

Have all the Silent Hills, Resident Evil's, GTA's, Metal Gears, Splinter Cell, etc. Loved Ico, love most of the first party Nintendo stuff.

[Fiend]

It's not a game. Also, **** squaresoft.

Words of wisdom. I salute you, sir.

[Izzy/K]

cool

[Cian]

What a descriptive title......

[flare60]

So what your saying is that becouse we like some of the games in the final fantasy series we are frantic fanboys/girls who are stupid and buy games just becouse of a title ?

Excuse me but what the f*** ?!

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

No, I'm not saying that just because you like a couple ff games there's anything wrong with you. I love Tactics, and FF6 was a great game. However, if you are a fanboy and buy games just because of the title, I would say you're stupid.

[FigureFour]

So what your saying is that becouse we like some of the games in the final fantasy series we are frantic fanboys/girls who are stupid and buy games just becouse of a title ?

Excuse me but what the f*** ?!
If you played FF8 and Vagrant Story, and you prefered FF8, then you are a fanboy.

If Squaresoft had called Vagrant Story "Final Fantasy 8" it would be heralded as one of the best RPGs of all time. If they had called Final Fantasy 8 "Vagrant Story" no one would have given a shit.

[Lexar]

Also I hate square-enix because since they merged they dont give a damn about the ogre battle series anymore. Damn you squaresoft! /fistshake (too much guild wars)

[Alucard1515]

Damn, talking about Final Fantasy has gotten to the same place as talking about Dragonball Z.

I'm not going to tell anyone what they should and shouldn't post (unless you're being disruptive, obviously), but it is kind of obnoxious to CONSTANTLY crap all over something that someone's trying to discuss. I think everyone's feelings on Final Fantasy are pretty much known, so there's no need to repeat them over, and over. If you want to discuss it, fine (even if it's something negative), but just posting things like "Squaresoft sucks" or bashing on Final Fantasy without anything really constructive to add to the conversation, you're just annoying people. It's getting to the point where people can't hold a conversation on it, becuase it's constantly being derailed.

[Lexar]

No I was serious, the team that used to work on the ogre battle series now works on final fantasies, (fft and ff-x were made by them for example, and the soon to be made ff-xii). And since the merge there haven't been new OB games. And none on the horizon either. I was kinda hoping the E3 would have an announcement of a new ogre battle or tactics ogre game, but it seems like they just forgot about one of the pearls of video gaming in favor of the big money which comes with big names.

[mofo09]

i hate ff

[Oceans Andrew]

i hate mofo09

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

I hate everything
I hate everything
I hate everything
I hate
I hate

[TheSorrow]

Wtf?!

[Yeef]

**** it up, pigface.
**** it up, pigface.
**** it up!

I honestly don't understand why square is so popular. THey haven't really put out anything that great since the PS1 days as far as I'm concerned.

[FigureFour]

i hate ff
FF hates you.

[OniCloud]

I honestly don't understand why square is so popular. THey haven't really put out anything that great since the PS1 days as far as I'm concerned.


This is very true.

10 sucked, plus they made an even suckier sequel to it.

online is ok, not much gawk at though

13 is just around the corner, I hear some good stuff about it, but not alot.

As far as I'm concerned I think they're running out of good stories to make up. and they're getting lazy.

And I hate the liberal media.

[Yeef]

13 is just around the corner, I hear some good stuff about it, but not alot.12*

And I hate the liberal media.Great Moments in Punditry as read by Children (http://homepage.mac.com/njenson/movies/dspunditry120804.mov)

Hooray for offtopicness...

[Erowid]

What does omfg stand for?

[FigureFour]

It stands for "Oh My ****ing God."

As in "OMFG! this noob doesn't know what OMFG means!"

[Erowid]

Oh geez, I thought it had something to do with final fantasy...

[Fishlike Samurai]

Well some people think it does.

What I think is weird about Final Fantasy is that the part 1 would be the FINAL Fantasy, which pretty much means last and then they stick 20 after it. That would be like making a game serie that is named like:
Best Game
Part 2: Even better game
Part 3: EVEN better game
Part 4:EEEVEN better game
Part 5: EEEEEVEN better game
Best game tactics
Part 6: EEEEEEEVEN EVEN better game
Part 7: Damn my E-key broke down

[clintrussell]

I have FF9 and FF10

Still havent beat either of them :squint:
So I wont buy another FF for awhile

[bigyellowlegoman]

I actually quite enjoyed FF10, the graphics were great, the storyline was involving, but the gameplay was utterly dire. A paradox???
Meh, I stuck with it and don't regret the time I spent playing it.

[Izzy/K]

Im not a FF fan at all, but, I do own FF7, tactics, and ive borrowed X and X-2, but I must say X and X-2 didnt impress me at all. I favor 7 out of all of them, and tactics 2nd.

Believe it or not ,in a way,I prefer Xenosaga better than X....

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

Tactics was so much better then 7 it's not even funny.

[flare60]

I own pretty mutch the entire final fantasy series, but the only reason i do that is becouse im a game collector and try to get series complete and such.

Sure the ones i favor are :

Final fantasy 1

Final fantasy 3

Final fantasy 6

And final fantasy 7

----

Why ? Becouse i like these, these are in my opinion very good games considering the times they came out.

What alot of you fail to get however, is that its VERY hard to get some real new things in terms of games and story these days since we have almost gone throu most story types, save being the villains instead of the heros (( this counts for the final fantasy series, it has been done before )).

The reason Square comes out with final fantasy is becouse that is what originally made them famous, theres a large fanbase.

If you played FF8 and Vagrant Story, and you prefered FF8, then you are a fanboy.

If Squaresoft had called Vagrant Story "Final Fantasy 8" it would be heralded as one of the best RPGs of all time. If they had called Final Fantasy 8 "Vagrant Story" no one would have given a shit.

You know what i hate ? I hate that people CONSTANTLY HAVE TO SAY THAT DAMN LINE !

Vagrant story is one of my favorit games , I do not like that people have to say stupid things like IF IT WAS CALLED !

You really should have taken in account that several games that became hits came out at the same time as vagrant story, as such it was a sleeper hit but still made a good sale in the strategy rpg department.

SO STOP DEGRADING THE GAME BY SAYING IF !

[Izzy/K]

Tactics was so much better then 7 it's not even funny.

Gameplay yes, story, I.......I...... I would have to go with 7

[Lexar]

That's because it was heavily inspired by (I'm not saying ripped off) tactics ogre, so it's logical the gameplay owns.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

Then I have to think that you have no idea what makes a good story.

[flare60]

I have to agree with bran, thou final fantasy 7 had a good story, it wasnt finished at all, in fact the entire ending was cut and remade so that the game was ready to be sent out.

Square has admitted this, and its a shame, but thats just how it is.

Tactics had a complete storyline, final fantasy 7 didnt.

[FigureFour]

IYou know what i hate ? I hate that people CONSTANTLY HAVE TO SAY THAT DAMN LINE !

Vagrant story is one of my favorit games , I do not like that people have to say stupid things like IF IT WAS CALLED !

You really should have taken in account that several games that became hits came out at the same time as vagrant story, as such it was a sleeper hit but still made a good sale in the strategy rpg department.

SO STOP DEGRADING THE GAME BY SAYING IF !
Good job missing my point.

I love Vagrant Story as well, and I thing FF8 was a miserable piece of shit.

I am implying that FF8 only sold well because it was the new Final Fantasy game, while Vagrant Story (a superior game in every way) was overlooked.

[bigyellowlegoman]

FF tactics seems to have been quite a great game that I unfortunately missed out on, it's frequently mentioned over at gamefaqs.
I was wondering, how would it hold up today? I was thinking of finding a copy, that's if age hasn't done it much harm.

[flare60]

Good job missing my point.

I did not miss your point, I just didnt like the fact that you used the line : IF IT WAS CALLED.

Im just really sick of hearing people saying that, And like i said, there was more then one hit game that came out during the time of its realese and such it got overlooked sadly.

Vagrant story is good but its sales got messed up by other games.

[flare60]

(( sorry about the double post ))

FF tactics seems to have been quite a great game that I
unfortunately missed out on, it's frequently mentioned over at gamefaqs.
I was wondering, how would it hold up today? I was thinking of finding a copy, that's if age hasn't done it much harm.

Graphic and gameplay has become better in games nowadays, but the story is very good and the game is pretty fun to play.

Just dont expect mutch in the graphics and you shouldnt have a problem.

Now finding the game, theres the problem.

[FigureFour]

Vagrant story is good but its sales got messed up by other games.
And IF IT HAD BEEN CALLED FINAL FANTASY 8 THAT WOULDN'T HAVE HAPPENED!

My point is that Squaresoft fans care more about the Final Fantasy name then the quality of the games.

[Izzy/K]

I have to agree with bran, thou final fantasy 7 had a good story, it wasnt finished at all, in fact the entire ending was cut and remade so that the game was ready to be sent out.

Square has admitted this, and its a shame, but thats just how it is.

Tactics had a complete storyline, final fantasy 7 didnt.


who cares? I didnt know that until now but I still think 7 is a little better. Mind you I like em both, but 7's got a little nudge higher in my mind

[FigureFour]

But 7 had a terrible story and Tactics had an excillent one.

[Alucard1515]

And my opinion is right and yours is wrong.

[flare60]

And my opinion is right and yours is wrong.

.........

" simple throws Alucard out the window, closes and locks it "


------------------

Yeah the story in tactics really is better then final fantasy 7, but final fantasy 7 is a good and very fun game, if it wasnt i wouldnt be playing it 2 times a year from start to finish.

[Alucard1515]

Did you not realize that was sarcasm?

[Bloodstar]

I don't doubt that Vagrant Story would have sold more if it had been labeled Final Fantasy, but FF8 was not a bad game. Many people, including me loved it, despite the fact that its not perfect.

My main problem with Square is that they are great with their graphics and cutscenes as well as music, but they continually screw other things up. They constantly make bad design flaws in their games, make plots that don't make sense and make over-the-top annoying characters. Their is absolutely no reason for a company with so much talent to continually make the stupidest mistakes over and over. Hell, most of their design flaws in gameplay are easy enough to fix if you just brain storm a bit.

Basically I've just had enough and I'm not buying another Final Fantasy game until they can prove they can make me a game that's worth the $50 and isn't an insult to my intelligence.

[flare60]

Did you not realize that was sarcasm?

Actully i did, i just had the urge to throw something and well... :D

My main problem with Square is that they are great with their graphics and cutscenes as well as music, but they continually screw other things up. They constantly make bad design flaws in their games, make plots that don't make sense and make over-the-top annoying characters. Their is absolutely no reason for a company with so much talent to continually make the stupidest mistakes over and over. Hell, most of their design flaws in gameplay are easy enough to fix if you just brain storm a bit.

Yeah i agree, i hate the majority of annoying characters lately...
I wonder why they dont try and have older people as main characters ?

Becouse people are getting sick of the kids ruling all..

And especially sick of all the pretty boy main characters...

[Fishlike Samurai]

They should make an ugly 40 year-old beerdrinking neighbour with a hernia the main character for once :D

[Izzy/K]

they should make an evil dude the main character, and eventually changes his views and all that other crap. Takin over the world would be a pretty different style of FF

[FigureFour]

How about something NOT cliche and make the evil main character destroy the planet in the end.

[Lexar]

How about not having a good/bad struggle at all, and instead make an epic adventure about heroes that only want to help themselves and that aren't too sure of their cause. Fortune seekers and delusional megalomaniacs as main characters. Doubt and betrayal as themes in the story instead of goody two shoes teenagers fighting apolcalyptic battles against pure evil. And how about making it open ended? In ogre battle, your actual playing style (not even choices you make in conversations, but your actual way of playing) changing your character and the story, deciding who becomes your ally and your enemy? Customizing how your character looks would also be a plus because you wouldn't be stuck with skinny bishiboys as main characters, but if you were a fat girl you could if you wanted to.

No magic, but instead skill with weapons. Yes, you read it, no magic at all. The over the top magic attacks are becoming lame. You could still have monsters and a fantasy world, but no more magic, or at least narrowed down to one character please.

And drop the sort of anime j-pop style of dressing the characters too. They look awkward to us westerners.

If they did all that, I would play FF again.

[Wyrmslayer]

How about something NOT cliche and make the evil main character destroy the planet in the end.

Disgaea: Hour of Darkness is kind of like that.

FF if you like FFT, youll love Disgaea, its kind of childish at parts, but its really funny.

Good luck finding it though, Im surprised my dad got it for me a few years back for christmas.

Great Game.

[FigureFour]

I've been looking for it for a while.


Can I have your copy?

[Bloodstar]

Lexar, although I agree with some of your suggestions I think you asked for a little too much. You basically described a game that isn't Final Fantasy.

I don't think they have to change their formula, they just have to fix the things I mentioned before. Namely a story that makes sense, non annoying characters, and use some common sense when it comes to game design.

I like the ideas of characters that are out for themselves and a game that isn't about the world being destroyed though.

No magic though? Black/white/blue mages are all awesome. Slap yourself for even thinking that.

[Wyrmslayer]

I've been looking for it for a while.


Can I have your copy?

Sorry, but I still love it.

Maybe when I beat Baal.

Damn... so close.

[Naota]

I'm sorry, but I can't stand everyone agruing pointlessly and endlessly on how good a FF game is. Analyzing the storyline and gameplay and sharing your opinions is fine, that's what discussing is about, but these kinds of arguements will always end in an "it's good, no it's not, it's good, no it's not" battle, pointless!

[FigureFour]

In that case, I'd recomend you not reading anything in the video games discussion forum. That's what EVERY thread here becomes, and your whiney plea for sanity won't do shit.

[Naota]

It wasn't a plea of sanity, it's a basic fact of communication.

[Bloodstar]

Did I miss something Naota? I believe I was sharing my opinion. Its called discussion.

[Naota]

*sigh* I knew I'd get tackled if i tried. Never mind, I like Final Fantasy 10. There we go, I left myself open to even more verbal pounding.

[Bloodstar]

Lol, I was only disagreeing and then stating my opinions. I haven't bashed anyone for their opinion so don't worry.

[Wyrmslayer]

FF10 was ok, nothing great about it, it was good eye candy though.

FF games are whatever you want them to be, if you go in expecting to be disapointed (I do this for all games) when something you like happens, you enjoy it, and you feel better knowing that you got something better then you expected.

FFT was gold, and the SNES FF's were great, the PS ones are good, nothing great.

I think there so big because Square seems to have a Monopoly on RPG's

[Bloodstar]

FFT was great but it had its problems too. Most of them have to do with skill and stat developement.

[Naota]

FFT...you mean Final Fantasy Tactics? If so, I have the final fantasy tactics advance game, just dont know where it is. XD I thought it was pretty good and it got addicting to me, but it took like 30 min to an hour to get past the intro.

[Lexar]

ffta was a sad excuse of a tactics ogre rip off. You had these rules and your characters were knocked out like in pokemon, and you had to throw snowballs on the courtyard with your schoolbuddies and pick flowers in missions. With 12 year old main characters that looked like girls. I bought it only because it was kinda like TO, but I shouldn't have bought it. I got so frustrated by the rules those judges throw at you, restricting your gamelay, I didnt play it that much anymore.

[FigureFour]

Tactics Ogre rip off? I thought it was the sequal to Final Fantasy Tactics . . .

It was a half decent game, but it wasn't even close to as good as the original.

[Gaara]

I'm sorry, but I can't stand everyone agruing pointlessly and endlessly on how good a FF game is. Analyzing the storyline and gameplay and sharing your opinions is fine, that's what discussing is about, but these kinds of arguements will always end in an "it's good, no it's not, it's good, no it's not" battle, pointless!

No no, you're looking at this in too civil a manner. For instance, If I said, "I love FFVII."

And FF came in and said, "FFVII sucks."

I would simply say, "YOU SHUT THE HELL UP, I WILL KILL YOU, I WILL CUT OPEN YOUR HEAD AND DRINK YOUR BRAINS AND LIKE IT, YOU DIRTY BASTARD."

that's how these threads should go.

[Frank]

(off topic) but.. hey Gaara...have you read the latest chapter of the Naruto manga yet? XD Chapter 261

[Gaara]

I havent read it yet, when I looked for it last night it was not to be found. And ********* is unavailable for me right now...guess I have to wait some more.

[velcro animal]

I liked tactics more than the other games. The gameplay was way better, the storyline was gripping, and battles didn't consist of standing in one place.

have any of you ever played Vandal Hearts? it was like tactics, but your level mattered far less. It was all about your battle strategy.

[Lexar]

Tactics Ogre rip off? I thought it was the sequal to Final Fantasy Tactics . . .

It was a half decent game, but it wasn't even close to as good as the original.

No, the game was made after squareenix was formed, and the people that worked on tactics ogre made FFTa. Look at the screenshots and you'll get it. But in TO there are no judges, restricting your play and the characters can actually die, instead of being KO'd. And the story and characters/jobs are better.

http://www.gamerankings.com/screens4/468482/1.jpg

^ tactics ogre knight of lodis
v final fantasy tactics advance

http://www.galbadiax.com/ffta/screens/01.jpg

I hold squaresoft responsible for making a great concept all kiddy and lame.

[flare60]

I hold squaresoft responsible for making a great concept all kiddy and lame.

Well excouse Square enix for not making all games YOUR age limit.

I serioulsy dont think final fantasy tactics advanced is lame or kiddy at all, its fun to play and very addicting, add that you can pit your clan against other peoples clan and you make it even funner.

[Wyrmslayer]

Even more fun would make your point sound stronger.

But I dont DISLIKE final fantasy tactics advance, it just didnt come close to its predecesor.

When your working with... what is it? 32bit graphics, your kind of limited, and tactics ogre/final fantasy tactics are very similiar games.

Now who makes Tactics Ogre anyways, which company?

[Bloodstar]

Just because the people that worked on Tactics Ogre made FFTA doesn't make it a sequel to TO. They are two different games, even though they look alike.

Also your characters can die in Tactics. The reason for them getting knocked out is to give you a chance to use a pheonix down or cast life magic to bring them back to life. If three of that character's turns pass after being knocked out the body dissapears and you lose that character for good (at least as far as I know. I'm not sure about FFTA).

Edit: I'd add more but I have to go.

[Wyrmslayer]

In FFTA they can die, but only on certain maps.

The judge was annoying, it was more of a hassle, and I guess it was to get you to use a variety instead of just abusing one tactic.

[Lexar]

Tactics ogre was made by enix, or at least by a small daughter company of enix (quest) that has been incorporated by the behemoth that is now the monopolist of japanse rpg's, square-enix. It's made by the same team, the graphics are alike, in fact it's probably the same engine. Even the tiles are exactly the same size, and the attack animations are exactly the same. I mean, exactly. Before TO TkoL, quest made TO let us cling together for PSX and ogre battle for the snes and ogre battle 64 in the same ogre battle series.
Now obviously the slightly historical parallel views of the ogre battle universe and the era of the crusades, the open debate of religion, the fact that the game was open ended, and the 'bad' ending is considered the one that follows the story of the saga (quite refreshing in rpg land) and the higher difficulty, weren't the kind of thing square-enix wanted in the FFT game so they dumbed it down. Instead of heavy armored soldiers of all kinds of disciplines, male or female, we get unisexed FF races like moogles running around in jugglers outfits picking flowers and casting over done Firas and Blizzaras. LAME! Gone are political intrigues, the civil wars, the good man on the wrong side kind of enemies, and instead we have 12 year olds trapped from real life into some sort of perverse mockery of what is supposed to be a video game world they have to escape from. The influence of square-enix has restricted their artistic freedom, I cannot come to a different conclusion. Let's be honest here, compared to TO, FFTa is nothing but annoying, your characters going to jail, having to check what you can and cannot do before every battle, keeping track of cards to alter the rules, losing characters for some sort of missions they do on their own but you never see, clumsy interface especially with the items, not being able to name your characters besides the main character, and really annoying music, it's not working in FF's advantage here. Usually that wouldn't be much of a problem, I'd just play TO (which has an actual VS multiplayer option, and 8 players instead of 6 on your team, and you can have monsters, dragons, giants, demons, angels, mermaids imps, ghosts, anything you like on your team. Did I mention Liches?) but since only FFTa was released in europe, it's the closest thing to TO I can find. Yes, I am not afraid to admit, I downloaded a rom to play a game, everybody does it anyway. Damnit, Tactics ogre was a work of art, and has everything an rpg should have, and FFT was a piece of crap for the masses.

At least I have chicken

[Wyrmslayer]

Go watch a movie, youd probably like that better than games.


Final Fantasy Tactics Advance was pretty terrible, and you seem to hate it so dont play it.

Oh goodie, you down loaded a Rom, I have openly downloaded over 100 Snes, PS, Ps2, Xbox and PC games, aswell as a handful of movies.

If you dont like the FFT "series" (I use this loosely) then dont play it.

Play your tactics ogre over and over and over again.

[Bloodstar]

I don't know why you wasted all that time talking about FFTA since we all basically agreed it was crap compared to the original.

You're just going to have to stick with playing the old ones like Wyrmslayer said until they make another game (that is, if they do).

[Snowfox]

I don't care if FFTA is kiddish. It's fun. That's still the main point of -games- for me anyways.

[Frank]

I havent read it yet, when I looked for it last night it was not to be found. And ********* is unavailable for me right now...guess I have to wait some more.
wel if you've read the previous chapter I'm guessing the title of 261 upset you a bit XD

[Lexar]

I was trying to point out the influence squaresoft has, because that's what we were talking about. Let me make it easier: TO = great game TO + squaresoft = FFT FFT = crap game. Thus the problem is squaresoft.

[Wyrmslayer]

I was trying to point out the influence squaresoft has, because that's what we were talking about. Let me make it easier: TO = great game TO + squaresoft = FFT FFT = crap game. Thus the problem is squaresoft.

Your logic is flawed.

I like to refer to this flawed logic as "flawgic".

And your Flawgic is undeniable.

[FigureFour]

I was trying to point out the influence squaresoft has, because that's what we were talking about. Let me make it easier: TO = great game TO + squaresoft = FFT FFT = crap game. Thus the problem is squaresoft.
Especially since Final Fantasy Tactics was a ****ing brilliant game with a mediocre sequal.

[Lexar]

Yeah the FFT on the psx was okay. But then again, you didn't have to pick flowers with metrosexual juggling moogles to win missions, did you?

[FigureFour]

That homophobia is really getting to you isn't it?

Honestly, I don't give a shit if there are a few flower picking missions. How the hell is picking flowers a down side? Just because someone isn't decapitated every scene doesn't make it a bad game.

And what's your problem with moogles?

[Snowfox]

Moogle-rainbow power.

[Wyrmslayer]

Im with FF on this.

Sure if you went to see the terminator or Rambo, you wouldnt expect him to go picking flowers for his sweetie, but then again, this isnt The Terminator or Rambo.

FFT was brilliant, like I said before, you go play your Tactics Ogre, and keep playing it until a sequel that you think is worthy comes a long (Which may take a long time)

So please, get off your high horse.

[Hiltz]

I've only played Ogre Battle 64, fun game it was.

[Bloodstar]

He was talking about FFTA not the original, and I'd have to agree. While I don't mind flower picking missions (I mean, you fight monsters) the races in FFTA really didn't add anything to the gameplay. It really just forced you to be a certain race to play as a certain class, which is really annoying if you're like me and want to play with humans. I like moogles, but I like them as summon monsters or NPCs. I really don't want to play as a stuffed animal looking thing.

And metrosexual doesn't imply being gay, it can be a male of any sexual orientation, but yeah, I fail to see how that describes a moogle.

[FigureFour]

He was talking about FFTA not the original, and I'd have to agree.

I know what he was talking about.

While I don't mind flower picking missions (I mean, you fight monsters) the races in FFTA really didn't add anything to the gameplay. It really just forced you to be a certain race to play as a certain class, which is really annoying if you're like me and want to play with humans. I like moogles, but I like them as summon monsters or NPCs. I really don't want to play as a stuffed animal looking thing.

That's nice, but you shouldn't consider your personal preferences of fantasy races to be a flaw in gameplay. Race specific classes aren't a bad idea, it helps to give the races style and culture. The only problem there is that YOU don't like playing as a moogle.

And metrosexual doesn't imply being gay, it can be a male of any sexual orientation, but yeah, I fail to see how that describes a moogle.

Actually, metrosexual implies a heterosexual male who acts like a homosexual.
Homophobe implies that he hates homosexuality.
It is logical to assume that heterosexuals who act like homosexuals would be hated by homophobes as well.

[Melch]

Honestly, I dunno why people seem to hate FFTA so much. Maybe I just enjoy it more than the original because it was faster paced. I just didn't enjoy that it took me half an hour for one battle, only to be killed right near the end. Granted, I'm not good with tactical games, but it took me forever to get started on the first battle. I played for a while after that, but I eventually stopped with FFT for the reasons mentioned above.

As for the Vagrant Story/FF thoughts, I think the main reason they wouldn't title Vagrant Story as FFVIII because it didn't have a similar play style (as in, gather a party and fight turn based battles). I enjoyed VS, but I think I like FF better, just because I prefer the FF gameplay style better.

~Melch~

[Bloodstar]

I know what he was talking about. Sorry. I might have read too fast or something.

That's nice, but you shouldn't consider your personal preferences of fantasy races to be a flaw in gameplay. Race specific classes aren't a bad idea, it helps to give the races style and culture. The only problem there is that YOU don't like playing as a moogle. I didn't call it a flaw, merely said it didn't add anything in my opinion.

Race specific classes are stupid. Think about it. If a person likes a certain race but wants them to have a certain job they should be able to do it. They shouldn't be forced to play a class they don't like to get a job, or vice versa. Its just common sense to give the players freedom to play the game the way they want.

As far as adding culture and style though, you don't need to create races to do that. Just look at real-life. There are plenty of cultural differences between people in the same race. Its not that you can't do it by creating races, but it isn't needed.

One problem I had with the races though is that it completely changed the feel of the game. Since I was a fan of the first game I expected the sequel to be an improvement only. Instead they totally changed it by adding all these new races and such. That's different. I wanted the same thing, just more polished and with a new story.

Actually, metrosexual implies a heterosexual male who acts like a homosexual. We are both be right (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrosexual).

[Lexar]

Not to mention the 'human' race in FFTa are also weird. Are they male or female? You could change jobs and become a girl, like changing from warrior to paladin, having a guy and suddenly having a girl. That's lame. And they all look like they're 12.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

You couldn't change gender.

And the race specific jobs made sence. The Veera for example were insanly powerful with magic, so they were the only ones who had the power to be summoners. It made sence and it added more depth to the stratigy.

[Lexar]

No you cant change gender, because there is none. Not even in the human race. Instead you get some kind of inbetween looking sort of characters.

Let's be honest here: Is this 'cool'?

http://www.ffshrine.org/ffta/Images/ffta_intro.jpg

Yes, that's the main character. At least I'm fairly certain about his gender, but I have no clue about the others.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

It's cooler then Cloud.

And there were genders, there were male and female charecters, and it did not change their gender to switch jobs.

[Lexar]

I have the game, I know what I'm saying. The characters in the story have genders, well sorta, they all look like kids anyway, so you cant really tell, but the ones you recruit, with the random names, thus the real humans as far as human race classes go, dont have a gender.

Now take the paladin class. First of I want to say it's a prettyy innovative and fun twist to the usual paladin by making it middle eastern kinda looking, but you REALLY can't tell a gender. Same goes for the thief class and some others I can't remember.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

I also have the game and have logged in like 70 hours into it, they don't switch genders.

Yes some costumes obstruct you from being able to view, but that doesn't change anything, it just makes sence. Why do you care about it being a male or female so much? Can't you remember from the name?

[Lexar]

I could say the same thing: why do you care so little about what the characters look like and how it plays a part in the gameplay.
I just don't like squaresoft's taste for easthetics and design in their games anymore. Not since ... more or less FF7 or 8. But I could live with that, untill they make it a feature in the game, where you can play as either cutesy moogles and whatnot, or fragile looking children who could be any gender, that's where it goes too far.

[FigureFour]

Race specific classes are stupid. Think about it. If a person likes a certain race but wants them to have a certain job they should be able to do it. They shouldn't be forced to play a class they don't like to get a job, or vice versa. Its just common sense to give the players freedom to play the game the way they want.
No, it's not. If you could play the game exactly how you wanted, they'd be selling programming tools.

As far as adding culture and style though, you don't need to create races to do that. Just look at real-life. There are plenty of cultural differences between people in the same race.You missed my point, just like you always do. It adds culture and style TO THE RACES. READ WHAT I SAID.
Its not that you can't do it by creating races, but it isn't needed.
Sure they could have done it a different way, but they have to chose one way to do it don't they?

One problem I had with the races though is that it completely changed the feel of the game. Since I was a fan of the first game I expected the sequel to be an improvement only. Instead they totally changed it by adding all these new races and such. That's different. I wanted the same thing, just more polished and with a new story.
The game takes place on another continent. It's perfectly reasonable that there might be other races there.

I could say the same thing: why do you care so little about what the characters look like and how it plays a part in the gameplay.
I just don't like squaresoft's taste for easthetics and design in their games anymore.
Our point is that you are bashing the game because you don't like the style of the art. It's not even like it looks ugly, you just don't like the style.

Fine, don't play it. Doesn't make it a bad game.

I suppose you also were complaining that it was similar to another game made by the same people (supprise supprise) but that's also a dumb arguement.

[Lexar]

No you dont seem to get what I'm trying to say. The art, I don't like it, fine, but annoying elements from that art find their way into the gameplay, such as genderless characters, and having these powerfull characters that don't look at all impressive. It makes the game very odd and awkward to play. That's the problem.

Of course that's not the only thing wrong with the game, but it seems I have to explain it over and over again :( But yeah, I don't play it. it's just that people will immediatly like it because it's from square, when there's a much better and and in the core elements, a very similar title out there that doesn't have the final fantasy tag on it, but because of that, it's less popular. It's injustice.

Also, art style does indeed make a game good or bad. Wrong implemented styles can be very bad, even if the game itself has good detailed graphics. Same goes for music. The music itself can be good, but if it's the wrong style, it won't suit the game.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

People play TA more, because a lot of people don't have old systems, so they can't play really old games. End of story.

Also, I fail to see how "That charecter has robes! I can't see her boobs!!!" is a valid complaint. Because that seems to be the only reason I can think why the ninja's costume would bother you.

[Lexar]

I'm talking about TO for the GBA.

[Bloodstar]

And the race specific jobs made sence. The Veera for example were insanly powerful with magic, so they were the only ones who had the power to be summoners. It made sence and it added more depth to the stratigy. That's one of the reasons races and class specific jobs bothered me. And it didn't add any depth or strategy. It just says if you want to play as this class, or have these strengths, you have to play as a bunny woman. Yay.

No, it's not. If you could play the game exactly how you wanted, they'd be selling programming tools. That's just incredibly stupid. And its also not what I said.

You missed my point, just like you always do. It adds culture and style TO THE RACES. READ WHAT I SAID. WELL THEN I'M ****ING SORRY. Its an easy mistake to make. Just tell me I misread it.

Sure they could have done it a different way, but they have to chose one way to do it don't they? Yes, they do. So why change it from the original though?

The game takes place on another continent. It's perfectly reasonable that there might be other races there. The continent looks different but they said it was Ivalice. Is it a different Ivalice? Either way, it still doesn't change my mind about it.

[FigureFour]

Also, art style does indeed make a game good or bad. Wrong implemented styles can be very bad, even if the game itself has good detailed graphics. Same goes for music. The music itself can be good, but if it's the wrong style, it won't suit the game.
Yes, but the style suits the game, you just don't like it.

[Lexar]

It's one of the things I don't like, also I don't like the story and the things they changed about a good game idea. Like the judges and the multiplayer that isn't a multiplayer because you can't fight other people directly. I don't like the characters themselves purely on their personalities either. I don't like that you can't play in your own style by developing a team that works in a sort of system because the rules make you constantly change the team set-up, and you never get that 'this is my team, and this is how we do it' feeling you got with TO. And memorizing forbidden moves isn't fun.

[The Bran Eating Zombie]

You can fight other people directly, you and someone elses teams fight.

And you don't have to memorize the moves, you can check them whenever you want.

The judges were a huge part of the gameplay and caused you to constantly change your stratigies, it was a great way to stop the game from getting boring and repetative, you could fight the same team on the same map, and it would be a completely different battle depending on what moves were banned.

[Lexar]

In TO you had to use the terrain and the enemies to change strategies, not some sort of enforced random potential restricter system like in FFTa. On many game boards this system is generally loathed for being a cheap way to make people think. There is no such thing as planning and building a team and a strategy if there's going to be random things that are restricted. it's more about having lots of different classes to limit the effects of the rules instead of really thinking it out and customizing accordingly.

[Wyrmslayer]

In TO you had to use the terrain and the enemies to change strategies, not some sort of enforced random potential restricter system like in FFTa. On many game boards this system is generally loathed for being a cheap way to make people think. There is no such thing as planning and building a team and a strategy if there's going to be random things that are restricted. it's more about having lots of different classes to limit the effects of the rules instead of really thinking it out and customizing accordingly.

You use the strategies for different enemies all the time:

Archers you get close.
Knights you get far away.
Mages you kill as fast as possible.
Healers should always die first.

Its like that for almost ALL games, no matter what game it is, the big damage dealers go down ASAP, along with the healer, the others die fast without healing.

People like it because its square?

It seems like a good idea to take shots at square these days, sure, they make mistakes, who doesnt (although they make more then they should it seems) FFTA wasent the best, but it was still good.

You need to look past things and look at the overall picture.

Many people here seem to just hate square because there a huge company and they make Final Fantasy and thats *all* they have going for them.

[Bloodstar]

Whether a game is good or not is up to the person that plays it.

[Lexar]

No, I can look at the overall picture, it's the people that play it because of the FF tag on it that don't see the whole thing. If some other company made it it wouldn't have sold very well, because it simply isn't that good a game.

And that strategy (I wouldn't call it that exactly, but for the sake of argument) is just what doesn't work in FFT. You can throw the whole strategy away with those rules. You can invent an elaborate and good working system using your characters optimally, but once you get a non-healer rule or a non-sword rule in your fight you can simply throw it out the window. Most of the time you find yourself making up last minute teams and team tactics because you get restricted on random tactics. It's a cheap way to add depth and I can see through it. Also it's annoying to have to remember it, if you happen to forget something insignificant like not using broadswords instead of regular ones you might find yourself losing one character on the field for it. Not to mention having to check the stats of every single character before the battle to make sure they would be allowed to fight, every single time, is quite annoying.

[grim_wulf]

I have to agree with lexar, i find the rules in FFT to be incredibly annoying. I keep forgetting to check the rules :/ and its causing problems to say the least.

[FigureFour]

No, I can look at the overall picture, it's the people that play it because of the FF tag on it that don't see the whole thing. If some other company made it it wouldn't have sold very well, because it simply isn't that good a game.
Keep in mind that I've hated almost every Final Fantasy game since 6 and I still think you are totally wrong here.

And that strategy (I wouldn't call it that exactly, but for the sake of argument) is just what doesn't work in FFT.
What the hell WOULD you call it?
You can throw the whole strategy away with those rules. You can invent an elaborate and good working system using your characters optimally, but once you get a non-healer rule or a non-sword rule in your fight you can simply throw it out the window.
You mean you might have to CHANGE YOUR STRATEGY TO ADAPT TO UNPREDICTIBLE CONDITIONS ON THE BATTLEFIELD? HOW TERRIBLE!

Most of the time you find yourself making up last minute teams and team tactics because you get restricted on random tactics.
No, most of the time YOU find yourself making up last minute teams and tactics. I wasn't an idiot and had backup plans.

It's a cheap way to add depth and I can see through it.
Are you saying depth is a bad thing?

Also it's annoying to have to remember it, if you happen to forget something insignificant like not using broadswords instead of regular ones you might find yourself losing one character on the field for it.

I'm sorry your memory is too bad to remember one or two things at a time. Seriously, you are complaining that if you screw up, you might lose because of it. OF COURSE YOU CAN LOSE A CHARACTER! YOU JUST SCREWED UP!

Not to mention having to check the stats of every single character before the battle to make sure they would be allowed to fight, every single time, is quite annoying.
Or you could just know what weapons and abilities your characters use. You know, you should really know that regardless of the rules, just so that you won't suck royal ass at the game.

[flare60]

Seriously Lexar i really think by going throu your posts that your bitchy as hell becouse not everyone hates square or final fantasy tactics .

Guess what, GET OVER IT !!!

And the fact that you bitch over that you have to change your strategy in the game becouse the way you wanted to go isnt happening , is god damn retarded, its a strategy game YOUR SUPPOSED TO HAVE TO MAKE CHOICES AND CHANGE THINGS !!

Furthermore you keep drooling over ogre battle like what you yourself hate, a little FANBOY ! You keep yelling how orignal it was !!

If you botherd to investigate most strategy games that are out there YOU would have noticed that they are ALL very alike in certain points YET stand out in other points !

But no, you keep yelling " OGRE BATTLE RULES !!! FINAL FANTASY TACTICS ADVANCE SUCKS BLAH BLAH BLAH " .

And furthermore if the ruling and judges in the game wasnt there, i wouldnt have liked it as mutch, it gives the game a diffrent form of battle then what im used too , and in my opinion the Judges are an excellent addition.

[FigureFour]

Seriously Lexar i really think by going throu your posts that your bitchy as hell becouse not everyone hates square or final fantasy tactics .
Haha! That is one of the stupidest things I've ever seen anyone say! It's not even a propper sentence! And on top of that, it doesn't make any sense!

Are you saying that he should like FFTA because some people don't agree with him?

Furthermore you keep drooling over ogre battle like what you yourself hate, a little FANBOY ! You keep yelling how orignal it was !!

If you botherd to investigate most strategy games that are out there YOU would have noticed that they are ALL very alike in certain points YET stand out in other points !

There's nothing I hate more then when an idiot sides with me in an arguement. He isn't drooling over it, he's comparing two similar games and contrasting their qualities to illustrate flaws and advantages. It's a common debating technique, sort of like your yelling like an idiot, but it's a bit more respectable.

But no, you keep yelling " OGRE BATTLE RULES !!! FINAL FANTASY TACTICS ADVANCE SUCKS BLAH BLAH BLAH " .

Actually, he constructed a much better arguement then you did.

[Lexar]

Flare60, don't you talk to me.

Now onwards with matters at hand here. Part of the fun in tactical rpgs is the fact that you build a team and devise a sort of system where all your characters have a specific role that contributes to the team. You have to be diverse enough to handle different situations like changes in terrain and different sorts of enemies or even tactics your enemies use. If a game can use those kinds of elements in the levels, it has genuine depth. However, this rule thing in FFTa isn't like that. It's just something unpredictable that requires individual characters to meet certain standards, and thus the team building is completely lost. Also the process of checking which character meets which standard before the match is time consuming and annoying because of the poor menu interface. It's not just having to remember what you can and cannot do, but it's the idea that you lose this coherent team because your individual characters have to meet these standards, and you can't predict up front what will be allowed or not, so you end up making the characters individually strong, instead of dependant on each other, and when you play a result of it, is that you end up playing the characters individually as well. The way you play it is just not the same.

Also, your characters gain skill through their items, so no, it's not easy to keep track of which of the 20 or so characters has which weapon because it changes all the time, to get new skills.

[FigureFour]

Part of the fun in tactical rpgs is the fact that you build a team and devise a sort of system where all your characters have a specific role that contributes to the team. You have to be diverse enough to handle different situations like changes in terrain and different sorts of enemies or even tactics your enemies use. If a game can use those kinds of elements in the levels, it has genuine depth. However, this rule thing in FFTa isn't like that. It's just something unpredictable that requires individual characters to meet certain standards, and thus the team building is completely lost.
It's supposed to be unpredictable. It forces you to build a balanced team that doesn't rely heavily on one ability.
Also the process of checking which character meets which standard before the match is time consuming and annoying because of the poor menu interface.
Once again, you should know what abilities your character can use.
It's not just having to remember what you can and cannot do, but it's the idea that you lose this coherent team because your individual characters have to meet these standards, and you can't predict up front what will be allowed or not, so you end up making the characters individually strong, instead of dependant on each other, and when you play a result of it, is that you end up playing the characters individually as well. The way you play it is just not the same.
No, the way YOU play it isn't the same. I built a balanced team that doesn't rely on any one character or ability. If one of my abilities is banned, the character with it uses something different and everyone else compensates for that. It's not like they are banning a character from participating, you just can't rely on the same trick working every time. It's simple strategy.

Also, your characters gain skill through their items, so no, it's not easy to keep track of which of the 20 or so characters has which weapon because it changes all the time, to get new skills.
Admitedly I don't like the new skill system, but it's not complicated or hard. You look at the new weapons to see what skills they offer, then you equip it to the guy who wants to learn that skill. You don't un-equip it till he has the skill. Then you give it to someone else.

[Lexar]

If it's supposed to be unpredictable, it shouldn't be like this. This is like rolling a dice in front of my eyes and saying which characters I can use and which I can't. It's cheap and shows that there is a serious lack of talent in the gameplay department if they have to resort to these kinds of things to make a game unpredictable.

But for a game that calls itself 'tactical' there is very little 'planning' very much of the 'luck' involved.

[polywantsacrakr]

Anyone who doesn't even like RPG's shouldn't really have a say on FF games imo. Of course X-2 was damn shitty but I seriously can't wait for XII.

[Lexar]

FF was one of the series that really made gaming fun for me, I grew up on FF adventure (technically legend of mana series but ok) and I still think FF6 is one of the best ever games, along with chronotrigger. FFT on psx I also liked, but what they did to TO, it's horrible. And I don't like the art direction they have taken since FF7 or 8. They should lose the features like the googles and the weird outfits and go back to the roots, feudal nations and heroes of destiny back when the men were men and the women looked like catwalk models. Now the men look like women and the women walking cats, almost. It wouldn't even have to be stereotypical, I mean, it sounds like it would, but the real stereotype is what the series have become. they are stereotyping themselves now. Oooh look a hero. Let's give him wild hair and a sword. He needs a girlfriend! No blonde though, god forbid. let's make them both teenagers! That has never been done before! Hey I know let's add a darker character that is just emo and not dark actually, and that one will be the favorite for the fans! Hey, let's use the same summons we always use! Yeah no need to think, this game will be the best ever!

[FigureFour]

If it's supposed to be unpredictable, it shouldn't be like this. This is like rolling a dice in front of my eyes and saying which characters I can use and which I can't. It's cheap and shows that there is a serious lack of talent in the gameplay department if they have to resort to these kinds of things to make a game unpredictable.

But for a game that calls itself 'tactical' there is very little 'planning' very much of the 'luck' involved.
I think the problem is that your 'tactics' aren't able to cope with any variance in strategy.

I NEVER had a character crippled by a rule. I simply had to change my playing style SLIGHTLY for the duration of ONE BATTLE.

[Wyrmslayer]

I think the problem is that your 'tactics' aren't able to cope with any variance in strategy.

I NEVER had a character crippled by a rule. I simply had to change my playing style SLIGHTLY for the duration of ONE BATTLE.

Same.

I always set the support ability to something usually not crippled, like here.

I gave my Dragoon that Temple Magic or whatever, so if he couldnt jump, use breaths, or use his spear, he could fall back on that.

Gave my whitemages, guess what? Blackmagic, or summoning magic, its so if they cant heal, they can atleast do damage, same with my summoners and blackmages.

When blades are banned, its kind of hard because I cant use my thieves, paladins, or whatever, but I still have magic and bows from my Hunters.

Seems just like FF said, you cant do a "This is my team, and this is how we do" thing, you have to do a "This is my team, we change depending on situation" which is better.

[Lexar]

You guys should play TO to have a better grasp of how much better it could be. We seem to be moving in circles with this issue anyway, so I won't bother anymore.
But I do feel insulted that you guys think I suck at FFTa or something along those lines, because I don't. I'm a master at tactical rpgs, however FFTa relies too much on the random and having individually strong and diverse characters, instead of building a strong and diverse team, which is maybe fine for most people, but I don't like it.

[FigureFour]

Seems just like FF said, you cant do a "This is my team, and this is how we do" thing, you have to do a "This is my team, we change depending on situation" which is better.
Not to mention it is a superior strategy as well.

You guys should play TO to have a better grasp of how much better it could be. We seem to be moving in circles with this issue anyway, so I won't bother anymore.

I've played TONS of turn based strategy games. It's one of my favourite genres. I know how good they can be.

[QUOTE=Lexar]But I do feel insulted that you guys think I suck at FFTa or something along those lines, because I don't. I'm a master at tactical rpgs, however FFTa relies too much on the random and having individually strong and diverse characters, instead of building a strong and diverse team, which is maybe fine for most people, but I don't like it.
I'm just saying that by building a strong and diverse team I overcame the problem you are complaining about.

After the first battle, I realised that I would have to play in a flexible way (not a big deal, since that's usually the best strategy anyway) in order to avoid getting screwed. And I never got screwed. Not once.

[OniCloud]

wow what are all you damn people's argu'n about? I thought this was about some ff7 thing I posted which I find out many people hate ff7 anyways.

Seriously your meaningless squabble has gone nowhere, go outside and take a breather.

I should change the title to "Omfg people argue over the stupidest things."

[Bloodstar]

It was a natural progression of discussion. One topic lead to another.

Anyways why did you bump this? Its been dead for over a week now.

[Lexar]

Also, why do you indirectly say that what we have to say is meaningless? If I recall you started a topic about FF7, and THAT my friend, is meaningless.

There is such a thing as debating for debating's sake, l'art pour l'art, shall we say? Maybe it's just a clash of arguments because, guess what, that's what you do on forums.